20-07-2018 08:22 AM
Dear "I can do this", you are certainly living up to your new name; keep going!
It sounds as though your daughter is, sadly, rather immature for her age (and 20 is young), and is finding it very difficult to accept her responsibility for you. Perhaps she's taken it for granted for too long that you, as Mum, are her rock and there to do things for her and look after her. She can't accept that her relationship with you has changed and your focus now has to be on looking after yourself and putting yourself first; she is now responsible for herself. She needs to be helped to see that if you are going to be able to support her in the future, you need her support now. After all, that is the nature of an adult relationship of any sort; mutual understanding and support.
Keep going with the psychologist. It's excellent you are now taking the lead in your sessions; it will be easier for her to help you. If your daughter will accept some individual support, that could be so helpful.
I don't know whether you've seen the Macmillan Cancer Support booklet, 'Coping with Fatigue - a practical guide to living with and after cancer'. It's pretty comprehensive and includes a section on 'Looking after someone who has fatigue'. Perhaps leaving this and other informative booklets in a prominent place in your home might help to get it through to your daughter that you have serious problems to be addressed.
As long as you keep up your honest and confident assertiveness, your psychologist will be able to help you, and your daughter will, eventually, see it's in her own interests to accept your illness and give you support rather than fighting you. After all, if she starts looking after you, she will automatically be receiving attention herself!
You can do this.
20-07-2018 03:53 AM
Corr "I can do this" - Loving your new name. Fandabidozeeee.
As I mentioned before, it might be an idea to also order any of the booklets addressed to "Carers of" to actually give to your daughter, and hope they may gently hit home?!
Good luck with it, me dear. Am keen to hear of yourself and future daughter results. I'm so sorry your having such a tough time with your chemo. But good to hear you kicked a*** with your psychologist. Sounds a great idea for her to also see your daughter, if she agrees to.
Keep looking after yourself.
Loadsa love to you and everyone on here
19-07-2018 08:10 PM
Since treatment 4 two weeks ago felt quite nauseous & really fatigued which has taken me a considerable time to find some sort of normality from.
This was all topped by disappointment from my daughter's behaviour and since the weekend felt quite distressed by her on going behaviour & feeling rejected so much so that I was unable to post but hung onto my new name knowing that I was seeing the psychologist today. I must admit I was apprehensive as she had very much sat in the fence regarding our situation. The appointment was in fact very positive possibly because I was completely honest and said I had felt at breaking point and desperately need some positive strategies to move me forward as to date I had felt no benefit. She took this on board and I am seeing her next week straight,after chemo. She may explore individual support for my daughter should she wish to take it up. I have learnt the hard way that I have to look after my own physical & emotional well being.
Apple tree I have ordered the publication you quoted from as well as a couple of others....Thank you for pointing me in the right direction.
Chuck 1 hope you are doing o.k. I also appreciate your on going contact.
Hope this thread continues to help all you other ladies on this challenging journey.
Take care everyone 😊 x
19-07-2018 03:26 PM
19-07-2018 01:58 PM
19-07-2018 10:23 AM
Brilliant, 'I can do this', you are now managing your own situation.
I have been reading the Breast Cancer Care booklet, 'Breast cancer and you: coping with diagnosis, treatment and the future.'
Here is a quote from a patient contributing to the section, 'What next?'
"I appreciate life a whole lot more and appreciate those who are important to me. I live more in the moment and try not to worry about things I can't change. The flip side is that I have very little time or tolerance for people who annoy me - I am probably a lot more blunt and to the point than I might have been before."
And here's another.
"I am a bit more likely to take a chance on something and live life to the fullest. There's an Irisih saying, "you're a long time dead," which has become a well-used phrase."
"I feel that life is too short to sweat the small stuff. I worry less about pleasing other people and focus more on what I want to get out of life."
Some great wisdom there.
Onwards and upwards.
13-07-2018 12:01 PM
Hello positive person (aka, but not for long - notbrave)
WOW - don't you sound positively different on your last Post - Good For You. I may be wrong but in order to change your user name you will need to email the forum moderators on firstname.lastname@example.org
Sorry if info turns out incorrect but I also just wanted to wish you the best with your treatment and everything else. Take good care of yourself. x
13-07-2018 03:37 AM
Good to hear from you again.
How are you doing?
Despite this being a challenging week after chemo 4 last Thursday the support and encouragement/ advice I have received on here has really helped me to put things in perspective and look at the emotional turmoil I found myself in from a different angle. It is definitely time to stop pressing the self destruct button and deal with the hear and now for my own self preservation.
Reading around the many threads on here makes you aware of the many dilemmas being faced on this journey. At the minute I will concentrate on my own physical and emotional well being and in building my strength hopefully face any on going or further dilemmas positively.
Wishing everybody in here strength to face each new day. I will continue to depend on you all and keep you posted quite possibly through a few more ramblings along the way.
Take care and be kind to yourselves.
No longer not brave.....I can do this 😊💟
13-07-2018 12:57 AM
Hi again Ambeingverybrave (please change your name to, flower!!)
Yes, she IS putting herself first. Yes, she has been through her own struggles recently, relationship wise, and moving abodes. And let's face it NB, had you a loving, caring, supportive husband or partner by your side, you probably wouldn't be griping so much about your daughter's current lack or inability of support. You wouldn't feel the need to so much? But you don't have (that right?). But, even if you HAD, I'm sure you would still be feeling somewhat indignant at her lack of support, her being your own Daughter. I would.
Thankfully, you have some very caring, supportive friends?? Without which, what or where would you be?, because she isn't being very supportive.
But, partner or not - she IS your daughter. She's also in a "caring"? profession!! Rehabilitation of what sort of patients? She sounds very ignorant about BC and treatments,and somewhat UNcaring towards you, so needs to be better educated - BCC and Macmillans leaflets?
Is it that she just can't cope with it, your illness on top of everything else she has going on? Is therefore wanting to put her head in the sand, because she can't cope? If it's down to lack of time - learning to apportion it, so all needs can be covered and satisfied. What I had to do that time following Dads stroke. Be there to help Mum, sort out some staff, and so a solution to be able to return back to my exams, still be support at the end of the phone and back at weekends.
What or how would you want her to be? Or be doing differently to help, than she is?? Write it down. Then, if and when you meet, or speak on the phone, it can then be discussed - "Negotiated". That's the word! To then hopefully reach a "Compromise" -That's the other word. In other words, you amicably, maturely come to an arrangement that suits and serves you both. Until you're in a better, and stronger position health wise again NB.
I don't think "control, authority" comes into it. She doesn't sound mature enough to think that way. I would be tempted to stop contacting her, go silent. And when/if she does contact, perhaps be unavailable to answer for a while. See what happens. When you do eventually answer, tell her how much her attitude has upset you, hence you've been silent. That you need to discuss this all with her, and that you're not prepared to speak to her unless you can have a calm, mature discussion, where she listens to your needs ref your health, and you to her needs ref her life, and you can both reach a compromise/arrangement. Tell her, now she's an adult and you've a serious health problem, she needs to realise support needs to be more of a two way thing. You really need and would appreciate some from her, until you're better. Rather than just you support her.
Sorry I've gone on again xxxxxx
No one (consultants for goodness sake!) would advise chemo if it wasn't felt necessary. Are you saying you were given an "option" to have or not?? If so, I'm sure you wouldn't have had it if you hadn't thought it necessary and a benefit.
12-07-2018 12:05 PM
Hello Apple tree,
Thank you for your support and response. Too I have put in a nutshell exactly my thoughts when they are rational ! Now I need to put these thoughts into practice!! If I can deal with BC I can do this.
I trust you and yours are coping with life?
Not Brave 😊
12-07-2018 10:38 AM - edited 12-07-2018 10:45 AM
Dear Not brave, please stop undermining yourself. You are being extremely brave and unfortunately your daughter isn't.
From reading the whole thread, these are my own observations.
• Your body, your cancer and your treaments all belong to you and not your daugher.
• All decisions about your treatments and how you cope with them are yours to make and not your daughter's.
• She is a very young 20 year old and perhaps needs some time to come to terms with the reality that, on this occasion, in these circumstances, you come first and she doesn't. It's clear she's still putting herself first and seems unable to look at your illness from your perspective.
• By trying to win your daughter round, and by getting friends of yours to speak to her, you are giving her an icreasing amount of power over you, which clearly she doesn't know how to use sensibly. This is very sad, but is her problem and not yours, and is an indication of her immaturity. She needs to learn how to take responsibility for herself as an adult, and how to be a supportive friend to you rather than trying to own or manage you.
• Very understandably you want to heal the rift between the two of you, but you might have more sucess if you concentrate on all your friends who are being supportive, and let your daughter do her own thing, without trying to win her round. You could try being firmly assertive with her, by indicating that you have made an informed decision about the treatments you have accepted, that it's a very difficult path for you to travel, but you have to do it. You would value her support, but you do not find further argument helpful.
Essentially, rather than trying to gain your daughter's approval and support (giving her continued authority over you), you make it clear to her that you have made your own informed decisions about your own body and your health, and whilst you value her views, ultimately you have to decide and act for yourself. Then you let her get on with being the person she is, and leave her to decide when she's going to contact you again.
Put yourself first and make the most of all those friends who are supporting you.
12-07-2018 07:25 AM
Good Morning Delly,
Any suggestions yourself or my other friends have are worth considering. Sadly these days I feel anxious about contact with my daughter wondering what the outcome will be. At the moment I'm not sure any suggestions I would make to her would be looked on favourably....she does not recognize that she has a problem, in her eyes the issue is me ! I accept we all have different coping strategies and deal with things differently. My two closest friends who are aware of the situation have considered trying to approach the subject but are both concerned it may add fuel to the fire. I know my daughter has discussed things with her colleagues at work.....she works as a health care assistant at a rehabilitation unit....I cannot make her understand rehabilitation is completely different from cancer .She now sees me as not having cancer since having had mastectomy and felt adjuvant chemotherapy was an unnecessary journey making myself ill with very little risk! She voiced this to the oncologist....if I had been told I did not warrant chemo I would have had to walk away &move forward but to be offered an insurance policy I wanted to take up that opportunity. Her view is,I am not I'll it is the treatment which yes is the case but would be helped if I thought she was supportive/ compassionate. She seems to base her knowledge / understanding on her colleagues experiences (a couple of them have had bc.) Rightly or wrongly I find myself at the stage of looking for my support elsewhere to try to build some cooing strategies. It is difficult not to feel each day is a struggle getting enough fluid on board and feeling a glimpse of normality in the hope that each new day is,a day nearer normality.....whatever that may be?? When I started th his reply Delly I intended to work systematically through your reply but as,you will have,read I have gone completely off on a ramble. No doubt you will make some sense of it and bounce back some reason to see me through this journey . Again with much appreciation for your understanding.
Not brave 💟 xx
12-07-2018 12:07 AM
Hi again Notbrave, but you are. VERY!
Anyone faced with dealing and coping with the vagaries of this gawb awful disease is. I've been thinking about you today, and what I said in my post. It wasn't a very good suggestion to maybe have a meal out to have a conversation - think it needs to be somewhere none public and comfortable for you both.
It sounds to be such early days for you yet, so you yourself still have much to deal with come to terms with. Both in the treatment sense and it's effects on you physically. Plus the psychological impact of it on yourself/person.
What do you mean by "she pushes me to the limits"? Thinks you should still be able to do what you did and be as you were before your BC? and not realising the effects the chemo and all of it has on you? "Fragile" and no doubt pretty weak and washed out.
Is it that she's trying to be "encouraging", to gee you up, but actually ignorant to the effects of the treatment, so is being too hard a taskmaster, when you actually need some gentle and tender caring, looking after?
I'm glad she was at yours at your initial diagnosis to support. Has she attended any of your chemo sessions with you? Seen how other people are also affected by it, maybe spoken to them. Read about it.
I note Ann saying "anger and in denial". Yes, Mum is often the "strong" one, the one "giving" help and support. I can remember the exact time, from having always been a supported daughter, the role being suddenly reversed to main supporter to my parents, after my Dad had a serious stroke, when I was in my early 20's. Unmarried and just going through my final degree exams, with a brother who was pretty useless and selfish. Hugely upsetting, difficult and stressful for my Mum, left to cope with running a guesthouse on her own. I just had to rise to it and rally with Mum, until we'd sorted her some reliable staff to help out and I could get back to study and exams. But it was a huge shock, that sudden shift in roles. Made me quickly "grow up". Plus - it's never ever a convenient time to get BC, a stroke or whatever other major health scare. It's the biggest bl**dy INconvenience and scare to you, Nonbrave, and to anyone else in your family and life. And - it isn't like some cold you'll quickly get over. BC is massive, major, a huge shock to you, let alone her.
You will get through it, recover physically. It may be gradually and slowly, take quite a while to get your strength back, as chemo knocks your whole body for six. You need to be gentle with and good to yourself, not expect too much too soon. But it is that much easier the more support you have and they need to be the same with you - gentle, encouraging and supportive. Be that your daughter, other family, and friends. Better for you and in speeding up your recovery if she "joins forces" with you, so to speak. Realises and accepts that you "need" some help, just until your more back on your feet. Whatever time and herself she has available to offer, give you, without feeling pressured, if that's what she is feeling.
Don't be surprised if the mental impact on you takes a lot longer. Took me a few years for it to stop being an annoying, upsetting niggle at the forefront of my mind and stop worrying about secondaries and the "what ifs".
I must apologise to both Ann and Dawn, I hadn't read your posts very thoroughly girls, because I also think Dawns suggestion of "speaking to someone a little distant" is an excellent one. We can often speak more openly to and listen to, without the highly emotional or hurt connection speaking directly to each other may emote or provoke to you both. A good friend of yours? who's very aware of how and what you're feeling and going through with BC, and what you're also feeling daughter wise, obviously.
I'd also wondered whether it would be of some benefit for her to read this thread?? Because it's very heartfelt and revealing!! As long as she didn't think you were tittle-tattling behing her back. After all, you posted here because you are genuinely struggling and needed someone to talk or rant to, some help, suggestions and were, as the title says, "Looking for Understanding" about. (This Forum's a godsend for)
I'm sooo glad you have some good friends to help and support you. Plus seeing a psychologist, tho' I'm not sure his/her response on your daughter was very helpful!!
I'm so sorry I've bleated on for so long. Please do keep us informed in how you are doing, health wise and daughter wise.
Lotsa love Delly xxxxxx
11-07-2018 02:37 PM
As always good to have your understanding ! It does help to release it by writing it down . When I started this morning in my reply to Delly only then realised how much hurt I was still experiencing. You hit the nail in the head though by saying there are only so many fronts you can battle at this time. I have very little fight left in me and have to take the point of view it is necessary to practise self preservation so that I don't go under.
Hope this message finds you coping.
11-07-2018 08:26 AM
11-07-2018 07:35 AM
Good Morning Delly,
Thank you for your response and support....I really do appreciate any suggestions which will help me to understand the changes in my daughter. Prior to my diagnosis we had a very close relationship but approximately 6weeks before this she had ended her relationship,with her boyfriend of 4years.. they had lived together for a year & she came back home in November &was here until March....she is now living alone in a flat 15minutes,away & has,a new boyfriend.
I suspect she is in emotional turmoil from this although very,adamant if where her future is going but sadly it,appears to have no concern for the feelings of others. The psychologist has,suggest her actions are very much related to her age & stage in life but I struggle with her lack of compassion.
I am6 days post FEC number 4. Had neutropeonic sepsis after 2nd cycle and until then had tried to put a face in things & have a wide circle of supportive friends. There are only a couple of friends aware if my dilemma as I feel so ashamed of my inability to deal with the situation. After being in hospital for 5days I tried sitting down with my daughter to explain how vulnerable I felt and in desperate need of her understanding but this seems to push her further away .
At the moment I am trying my best to survive by being positive that we still have contact and she hasn't turned,her back in me and hope time will resolve our difficulties.....maybe my expectations are unrealistic and I need to be more independent &less needy !
Apologies for my rant but your response has been therapeutic in the sense that I have,written down my immediate feelings.
With much appreciation.
Not Brave xxx